Meccano Factory Drawings
-465 Morris Van 'Capstan' (1957-59)
DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023
--38e Triumph Dolomite Roadster (not issued)
This is a thread for members to post discussions relating to acutions, shows, swap meets, sales of Dinky Toys etc.
Well, the first user of this thread, started by the late Peter Golden seven years ago!
See the interesting message and link below (although some older already):
2p Dinky toys fetch almost £50,000 at auction: Collection of 12 rare delivery vans from 1933 bought by private collector
'The two boxes were individually owned by John Westcombe and Julien Loffet, two great collectors Dinky Toys who sadly passed away recently.
'Their families united the collections for this once-in-a-lifetime sale.
'Dinky Toys were a worldwide phenomenon and even to this day their appeal is unending.
'In 1933 each van cost sixpence - 2.5p in today's money - but now they are more valuable than the real vans would have cost.'
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2843451/2p-Dinky-toys-fetch-50-000-auction-Collection-12-rare-delivery-vans-1933-bought-private-collector.html#ixzz41aeac3Ot
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Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2843451/2p-Dinky-toys-fetch-50-000-auction-Collection-12-rare-delivery-vans-1933-bought-private-collector.html#ixzz41ae24Knk
Julien was the previous owner of the 38 and 39 series' mock-ups, in the days when they were not the capital treasures yet which they are now, and he wrote about them in Modellers' World already:
LOFFET, Julien, Dinky designs. In: Modellers’ World 7:3 (April 1978) pp. 11-12.
-Article including pictures of the wooden mock-ups of the 39 series American cars, in those days in the possession of the author, who bought these and other models and parts, produced between some years before the war and 1945, from the original designer.
LOFFET, Julien, Dinky designs. In: Modellers’ World 8:2 (January 1979) pp. 6-7.
-Article including pictures of the wooden mock-ups and proof castings of the 38 series British sports cars, in those days in the possession of the author.
Kind regards, Jan
I originally posted this under the "New Arrivals" topic, when having done so, I realised that this Post should really be under "Auctions" as I have not as yet received them! I will be able to write about these models under the "New Arrivals" topic after I have received them!
I have just gone through two nights in front of the computer, watching and placing the occasional bid during the John Kinchen Collection auction conducted by Piers Motley Auctions in Exmouth, Devon. I am very satisfied with the lots that will be eventually coming my way, although things may change once I have the Dinky Toys in my hand! I am also somewhat disappointed with those lots I missed out on!!
The first is a very nice promotional 189 Triumph Herald, purchased for less than ₤90, a price that really astonished me although it should not have come to any surprise as this and the other promotional Heralds listed in this auction on either side of mine were not mentioned as being such. The description for the model I won simply stated, "Dinky 189 Triumph Herald Saloon in dark greyish green with white sides, boxed", although I could not hear exactly what the auctioneer stated when he introduced the lot. Of course, things may be different on receiving it!
Lot 575 is a 34a Air Mail Car, slightly fatigued, or should one say, greatly fatigued, but still the price was low, and I always wanted one of these, especially on seeing the photographs published in the Forum Topic on 23 October 2014 by Jan that followed the discussion initiated by Jacques on the New Zealand stamp that depicts the Air Mail Car.
Lots 1195 and 1196 contained Peugeot 403s, the first lot a 24b in grey and the other a later 521 issue in two-tone grey had been doctored by its previous owner. The last lot contained a 24b in blue and 521 in cream. I have always liked this model and these will be a welcome addition.
Lot 1279 is a nice example of a very nice model, and I felt pity on it when bidding seemed to have stalled!
I was surprised with some of the models that were sold; incorrect boxes, models that have been doctored and not mentioned as such, and more surprised to see how much some of these fetched. However there were many, many very nice models and well worth staying up until 4.30am each of the last two nights! Had I lived locally, I would not have hesitated bidding on far more. It was refreshing to see how many lots comprised of a single model and not two or three models that would require disposing of the unwanted ones.
Until now, I never seen a "royal air mail service" in this nice condition !
The Peugeot 403 are very well represented in your collection, with all these variants !
Some more to find
Bruce----Congratulations on a very nice "haul" of great Dinky items. Like you, I have always been fond of the Air Mail car, but the few I see are either quite expensive or seriously fatigued.......yours looks quite nice indeed, and will look forward to seeing your writeup on it.
Best regards, Terry
Well done, Bruce, especially winning the no. 34a Royal Air Mail Service Car would have been worth two sleepless nights for me too! Congrats and kind regards, Jan
Hi Bruce and all,
I had been in contact with John Kinchen (the owner of the collection sold at Piers Motley Auctions) for over forty years on and off. I did not meet him personally but did a few swaps over the years with him and I did note a few of them in the sale. John's collection sale was written about in the June 2016 issue of Model Collector (UK).
As the disposal was left to distant relatives (John was not married), it seems as if it was left to the auction house to match the boxes with the models, so that is why there have been mismatches. Piers Motley did a fairly good job considering they were not that experienced in the field.
I managed to obtain 3 Lots but was not 'keen' enough to stay up all night to pursue chosen Lots - New Zealand is 12 hours ahead of the UK (or 13 in their summer) and 2 hours ahead of Brisbane.
John talked about joining the DTCA but never quite got around to it.
On the cover of the catalogue for the Lacy Scott & Knight 19 November toys auction is an all-orange 903 Foden with 503 box. Was this ever released by Dinky or are all examples simply recreations? If the latter, I am surprised that LSK makes no indication of the fact.
I am always a little suspicious with models that can be so easily altered to represent a model that was not part of the original production sequence at Meccano but a brief, trial run. The only real way to tell a genuine for a forgery is the back having a rivet. This model in an early box came out only when a screw was in use. It would be useful to know if there is an orange end-spot on the other box end. LSK are a very reputable auction house, and reading their description, they have erred on being cautious with their statement.
Here are a couple of examples that have sold through another highly reputable auction house. In both examples, the description did not state that a rivet was used to secure the tray to the chassis which would have most likely guaranteed authenticity.
This model and its box sold for £400.00
The above model sold for an unbelievable sum of £2300 three years ago. Both examples still have a serious doubt as to their authenticity. Why? If genuine, the wheel hubs should have been green. These two models have all the hallmarks of a regular 501/901 Foden Diesel 8-Wheel Wagon - only with a 502/902 green tray. Ramsay's Price Guide is a reasonably accurate guide, and it states all the details as shown with the model below.
Now this is a genuine 902 having a red cab and chassis, green tray and green hubs. (Well let us hope it was genuine and the axles have not been carefully removed off a 902 and placed on a 901!)
The above sold four years ago for £1100, less than half the price of one having considerable doubt as to its authenticity.
The only way to verify a model is to carefully inspect it with a jeweller's glass to ensure nothing has been done with the axles, and any markings on the screw, and its nut.
Mark, I guess with the 503, it is a case of buyer beware unless it can be physically examined very carefully before lodging a bid.
Bruce H. (150)
Many thanks Bruce. Caveat emptor indeed. The vendor of this Foden has had it on Ebay in recent weeks with a buy it now price of £2495! There is no colour spot on the box as far as I can see so I guess there is absolutely no way anyone could say one way or the other that this is genuine.
Unfortunately there is every possibility someone will have their fingers burnt.
The following is from the "Latest News" column of the Vectis website:
Please Note: As from the 26th September Invaluable has increased their commission rate to all Buyers. As a result the commission rate for bidding through Invaluable will now be 27%. if you wish to bid 'Live' you also have the option to use the Vectis website and the charge for using this site is 24%.
27%! Wow - that is more than a quarter of the value of one's purchase! Then add credit card fees, and packing fees. OUCH!
I think I can speak on behalf of all of us who in the pursuit of their hobby have no alternative but to seek and obtain models for their collection through online auctions that it is now becoming increasingly obvious, that those who operate these auctions consider collectors of all persuasions to be a bottomless pit of unlimited funds. There must and always will be "administrative" charges but these are becoming increasingly unrealistic, and if the cause is the Internet itself, then perhaps we should revert to the old days!
For those living in another part of the world, these fees, plus postage is making the pursuit of their hobby increasingly expensive to the point when the enjoyment no longer exists and the need arises to seek an alternative outlet. Stamp collecting? There is the feeling of utter frustration, and a yearning for a return to the more simplistic, non-internet state of affairs.
There - had my whinge for the day!
Bruce H. (150)
Thank you very much for your most appreciated comments. I think I was reasonably lucky with the Peugeot variants I managed to acquire with the Piers Motley Auction. I know there are many more to locate, but I think I have my hands more than full with those Dinky Toys from the Liverpool factory!
I must confess, much to the chagrin of other collectors, to the cream Peugeot with the concave silver hubs and glazing in the windows, although my second favourite is the first version in grey! Having never had any of these in my younger days, and I often wonder why Bobigny did not include Australia as an export destination, as I am sure French Dinky Toys were assigned to France's overseas departments in the South Pacific such as New Caledonia and French Polynesia.
Thanks too for your kind words on my nice "haul" I now much regret I did not throw caution completely out the window, as I should have gone for more of those promotional Heralds, and those pre-war Chryslers. I am just glad that this auction was not on the radar of many collectors, as there were so many more Dinky Toys I should have had a go at winning! But please do not tell that to my "better" half!
I could not believe my extreme good fortune in winning the Royal Air Mail Service Car, as I had thought it would have been well beyond the size of my wallet. It currently resides on the computer desk, and I look at it frequently - like right now, including both the Herald and Peugeot! Those and the others were well worth the two sleepless nights. When the parcel arrived, it was like having two or more Christmas mornings rolled into one!
I wish I had the pleasure of meeting John Kinchen. In fact, although I used to buy most copies of DIECAST COLLECTOR, it was only when I started scanning all the Dinky related articles recently that I came to learn that John wrote many articles for that magazine. These articles have now taken on a new look and I much regret not attempting to contact John all those years ago. What an honour you had Ron, in corresponding with John K. - I do envy you!
I am sort of glad you were not "keen enough" to stay up all night!! Although this is probably where we should work together, knowing the lot numbers are of interest to both, and if you wanted to go to bed because the time would have been far later than here in Australia which was late anyhow, I could have done the bidding on your behalf to the maximum you want. I think this is where we all should work together rather than as competitors. The only problem being a lot that interests the both of us!!
Thank you fellows for commenting on my haul from the John Kinchen collection. I am afraid I have just a couple of real favourites that will stay with me for some time through thick and thin. Others I may sell in order to obtain something that I am really keen on acquiring. I wish now that I had won the lottery far earlier, actually, winning a lottery at all!!
Having moved to a very much smaller place, I am selling my set of six mint "Binns Road Gazette"
Also book "Dinky Toys" by Dominique Pascal
Les Dinky Toys et Dinky Supertoys français" by Jean Michel Roulet 1982
"Guide Dinky Toys Français" by Jean Michel Roulet 1994
"Pasionément Dinky Toys"
"Inestimables Dinky Toys" by Stephane Brochard 2009
"Diecast Toy Cars of the 1950's & 1960's" by Andrew Ralston
If anybody is interested please make an offer to email@example.com
Thanks and regards.
There's an interesting blog and pictures regarding the sale of a US collection over at QDT:
Mark, it's an interesting article with some great images. Thanks for the heads up!
This is the flyer for the January 2021 meeting at Orléans but will it happen ?
Rob van der Hoort's collection will be auctioned at Vectis on 20-22 September 2022 (three days).
(with a nice collector and collecting history).
I had the pleasure and privilege to take photographs of his collection at his home several times, in 2017 and 2019, for his articles about Fodens, Guys and special items he bought from the Williams collection, published in The Journal. Some pictures below: